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 Dallas Thomas still a problem 
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
Finster wrote:
Is there somewhere that can be verified, I thought that the adjusted cap money could not be transferred to the next year, that you can carry it for as many years as you like but once you decide to use it, it becomes the adjusted cap, and that adjusted cap money does not carry over.


The rule states that you can roll over salary cap space and once it is rolled over, it becomes salary cap space. So by definition, once it is rolled over, you can roll it over again.

The Dolphins have been operating under this "obscure" rule for two years now.



Too long!


Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:02 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Well every team is entitled to the roll over cap space...

It's there as part of the CBA to encourage ball clubs to spend more on players.... not necessarily bigger contracts... but to loosen the purse a bit and spend..... basically to stop being like the Buccanneers that were spending only 80 million a season... the idea is you can carry it into the next year... and still spend it.

So what if we use it... the point IS to roll over to next year, to give yourself the breathing room to spend if necessary.

Point is, just because you can spend it... doesnt mean you have to. If we spend whatever is left, that leaves no cushion for the following season.. so why cripple yourself now.

Some of you guys are on to the fact that as a young team... big extensions are coming up, and how they are handled has to be taken into account.

Yes, Tannehill will need a new contract by season end next season... the Franchise tag allows us to tag him so we dont lose him... but it will be cap crippling. I mentioned earlier foregoing his extension, and tagging him if necessary going into 2016. Yes franchise tags are expensive... but how many "franchise" qb's actually switch teams and excel? And with the handful of names you can toss out, how many did not excel. Most QB's are dependent upon familiarity and the players around them.... meaning, even if Tannehill doesnt get extended, it is doubtful he leaves unless shown the door.

But the plan has to be put in place on how other players are handled as the opportunity to extend comes up. Signing a guy like Boone (Kev this is towards you), is crippling in the future... it means some one wont get their extension.

Finster, i get your point. Other teams spend $30 million on their lines... those teams are basically in win-now mode due to a small window. Denver needs to spend to keep Manning upright, hes got only 2 years before hes done with the game... same could be said for brady.

No matter what happens this season. Miami is not in a position to magically win a Super Bowl, however much we dream. I think a playoff run is a good goal, maybe our first playoff win in a decade... sure. But dont cripple the cap for 2015, 2016 and 2017 on a trade and sign now.... in the hopes that you can get a 10 win season, because if not....... we become the "Dream Team Eagles"..... an afterthought for at least 5 years


Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:49 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:

The rule states that you can roll over salary cap space and once it is rolled over, it becomes salary cap space. So by definition, once it is rolled over, you can roll it over again.

The Dolphins have been operating under this "obscure" rule for two years now.

The rule states it, but I disagree. A cap should be a cap. Either spend it this yr or loss it.


Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:18 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Dphins4me wrote:
Rich wrote:

The rule states that you can roll over salary cap space and once it is rolled over, it becomes salary cap space. So by definition, once it is rolled over, you can roll it over again.

The Dolphins have been operating under this "obscure" rule for two years now.

The rule states it, but I disagree. A cap should be a cap. Either spend it this yr or loss it.


Completely irrelevant to the discussion.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
Finster wrote:
Is there somewhere that can be verified, I thought that the adjusted cap money could not be transferred to the next year, that you can carry it for as many years as you like but once you decide to use it, it becomes the adjusted cap, and that adjusted cap money does not carry over.


The rule states that you can roll over salary cap space and once it is rolled over, it becomes salary cap space. So by definition, once it is rolled over, you can roll it over again.

The Dolphins have been operating under this "obscure" rule for two years now.


Once rolled over though, it's considered "adjusted" salary cap, and I thought that adjusted salary cap was good for only that given year.

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Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:01 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
Completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Talk about someone who is oblivious to his own action.


Last edited by Dphins4me on Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Aug 18, 2014 8:28 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
On a side note ......

Quote:
I suggested several days ago the Dolphins should look into Alex Boone, the guard who is holding out in San Francisco. I don't believe that is likely to happen now based on issues relative to Boone's personal life and other matters.

Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins ... rylink=cpy

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Thomas is really bad, I can only hope he's not our best bet at RG, if not it will likely be a long season.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Dphins4me wrote:
NFLJunkie wrote:
I think the bottom line here is the OL remains a problem particularly at the guard position. It needs to be addressed and waiting for a guy to figure things out isn't the answer.

Miami is replacing its entire OL. I would be highly surprised if that has ever happened in NFL history to any team.

Why would anyone expect there not to still be issues & growing pains? I expect the entire yr to have OL issues. From what I always heard an OL is about 5 men playing as one. Not going to get that in a couple of weeks.

For instant gratification you will be 100% correct that it is not the answer.


I'll talk to you in week 8. If Dallas Thomas is still starting at guard, Ryan Tannehill will be on IR.


Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:57 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
NFLJunkie wrote:
I'll talk to you in week 8. If Dallas Thomas is still starting at guard, Ryan Tannehill will be on IR.

Ok, not sure about what. I've never said Thomas should be the starter or is capable of being it. Just said do not make snap judgements based on him being dominated by one of the best in the NFL. The hope for Miami is he improves and becomes a valuable part of the line.


Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:47 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Dphins4me wrote:
Rich wrote:
Completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Talk about someone who is oblivious to his own action.


We're talking about the mechanics of the CBA and you come in and tell us that you disagree with it.

We don't really care what your opinion of it is, we're discussing how it works.

Thank you for wasting our time.

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Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:41 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Finster wrote:
Once rolled over though, it's considered "adjusted" salary cap, and I thought that adjusted salary cap was good for only that given year.


It's just considered cap. The Dolphins have been very good at managing the cap using the cap rollover. They seem to be "pioneers" in this mechanism of the current CBA.

They are going to roll over enough cap so that they do not have to perform a fire sale next year, although they certainly aren't going to be in a position to spend like they have the past two seasons so some those rooks better step up and replace some of those big salaried veterans (Ellerbe and Wheeler).

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Shelley Smith is getting his turn. If Smith can hold his own and Turner develops enough to take over at LG during the season I'll be in better spirits regarding the OL.


Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:51 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Finally got to watch the game last night! HOORAY!!

Ok here's the thing i noticed with Dallas. He isn't bad blocking to his right..... BUT if the defender goes to his left... its MURDER.

Seems like Tampa kept going to the inside with swim moves and obviously towards his left side.

When asked to block to the outside (right) he seemed to be adequate.

Thing I take from that is, the left side is obviously an issue... im not sure if that means he's playing on the wrong side of the center, or if he just needs more work.

Thats kind of a glaring issue in my mind, hard to mask.... except if he were to move over to LG.... then the issue would be blocking out, not to the inside.

Either that, or McCoy was just that efficient with an inside swim move...I would say line him up against Wake for the next week and teach him how to defend it!


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
SkyHigh314 wrote:
Finally got to watch the game last night! HOORAY!!

Ok here's the thing i noticed with Dallas. He isn't bad blocking to his right..... BUT if the defender goes to his left... its MURDER.

Seems like Tampa kept going to the inside with swim moves and obviously towards his left side.

When asked to block to the outside (right) he seemed to be adequate.

Thing I take from that is, the left side is obviously an issue... im not sure if that means he's playing on the wrong side of the center, or if he just needs more work.

Thats kind of a glaring issue in my mind, hard to mask.... except if he were to move over to LG.... then the issue would be blocking out, not to the inside.

Either that, or McCoy was just that efficient with an inside swim move...I would say line him up against Wake for the next week and teach him how to defend it!


This guy practices against Randy Starks and Jared Odrick. Ok, they aren't McCoy, but they are pretty darn good. He shouldn't need to learn how to block it. I simply think he is too tall to play guard.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
This guy practices against Randy Starks and Jared Odrick. Ok, they aren't McCoy, but they are pretty darn good. He shouldn't need to learn how to block it. I simply think he is too tall to play guard.


Good point. That is one thing I always considered when reading practice reports about how the defense was dominating. Unfortunately Thomas looked lost.


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
SkyHigh314 wrote:
Finally got to watch the game last night! HOORAY!!

Ok here's the thing i noticed with Dallas. He isn't bad blocking to his right..... BUT if the defender goes to his left... its MURDER.

Seems like Tampa kept going to the inside with swim moves and obviously towards his left side.

When asked to block to the outside (right) he seemed to be adequate.

Thing I take from that is, the left side is obviously an issue... im not sure if that means he's playing on the wrong side of the center, or if he just needs more work.

Thats kind of a glaring issue in my mind, hard to mask.... except if he were to move over to LG.... then the issue would be blocking out, not to the inside.

Either that, or McCoy was just that efficient with an inside swim move...I would say line him up against Wake for the next week and teach him how to defend it!


I saw Max Lane in a retirement home the other day. One of the older guys pull a hump move on him and got the last serving of mashed potatoes. I don't think he ever figured it out.


Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:45 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Finster wrote:
Once rolled over though, it's considered "adjusted" salary cap, and I thought that adjusted salary cap was good for only that given year.


I went back and looked at this and you're correct. Adjusted cap cannot be rolled over.

That being the case, the Dolphins currently have $137 million tied up in the top 51 contracts for 2014 and will have $144 million tied up in the top 51 contracts for 2015.

What we can expect is for Ellerbe to be cut for a savings of about $5 million, And some other veteran guys such as Hartline, Starks, Finnegan, Mitchell, Wake, Gibson and Pouncey to have their contracts looked at.

With the depth at receiver and corner, Gibson, Hartline and Finnegan would be prime candidates to get the axe or, in Hartline's case, get traded for picks.

Mike Wallace has the biggest cap number, but is essentially untouchable due to the massive dead cap hit.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
you have close to 5 million in dead cap this year ..not on the books next year, also


Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:45 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Kev1321 wrote:
you have close to 5 million in dead cap this year ..not on the books next year, also


We still have $144 million tied up next year.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
I went back and looked at this and you're correct. Adjusted cap cannot be rolled over.

That being the case, the Dolphins currently have $137 million tied up in the top 51 contracts for 2014 and will have $144 million tied up in the top 51 contracts for 2015.

What we can expect is for Ellerbe to be cut for a savings of about $5 million, And some other veteran guys such as Hartline, Starks, Finnegan, Mitchell, Wake, Gibson and Pouncey to have their contracts looked at.

With the depth at receiver and corner, Gibson, Hartline and Finnegan would be prime candidates to get the axe or, in Hartline's case, get traded for picks.

Mike Wallace has the biggest cap number, but is essentially untouchable due to the massive dead cap hit.


I had been curious about rolling over adjusted cap. Didn't seem logical.

Overthecap has us on the hook for $150million in 2015 ....

http://overthecap.com/salary-cap/miami-dolphins

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Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:13 am
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rock Sexton wrote:
I had been curious about rolling over adjusted cap. Didn't seem logical.

Overthecap has us on the hook for $150million in 2015 ....

http://overthecap.com/salary-cap/miami-dolphins


$144 million.

Only the top 51 contracts count against the cap.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
We're talking about the mechanics of the CBA and you come in and tell us that you disagree with
We don't really care what your opinion of it is, we're discussing how it works.

Thank you for wasting our time.

Again. Someone who is oblivious to his current and previous actions.

I did not ask you to care or have an interest in your feelings. The world is not about you. You do not own this site so stop thinking you have the right to tell anyone what the can post.

If you want a thread about the cap and its working then get out of the thread about Thomas and start one on the cap. Until then your hypocritical mouth can remain shut on the subject.


Tue Aug 19, 2014 1:09 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Dphins4me wrote:
Rich wrote:
We're talking about the mechanics of the CBA and you come in and tell us that you disagree with
We don't really care what your opinion of it is, we're discussing how it works.

Thank you for wasting our time.

Again. Someone who is oblivious to his current and previous actions.

I did not ask you to care or have an interest in your feelings. The world is not about you. You do not own this site so stop thinking you have the right to tell anyone what the can post.

If you want a thread about the cap and its working then get out of the thread about Thomas and start one on the cap. Until then your hypocritical mouth can remain shut on the subject.


The thread is about Thomas not playing well at right guard. The discussion evolved into acquiring a right guard to replace Thomas since he is not playing well at right guard (you know, a solution to the problem). And from there to the cap ramifications of doing so, at which point I jumped in to provide information pertinent to the discussion (since a solution to the problem was presented, what are the mechanics of that solution). Mind you, I didn't participate in the evolution of the discussion from Thomas, to upgrading to cap. I simply added context.

You on the other hand decided to give an opinion about the current cap rules, which is completely irrelevant to the discussion about Thomas or right guard.

Connect the dots should be a very easy game to play. What's holding you back?

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Pretty sure Rich is our personal CAP GURU here... so any input he has on the inner workings and accounting procedures for the salary cap is welcomed.... especially when correcting assumptions made by us idiot posters.

He does have a cap thread on "sticky" on the top of the forums too... or at least there was..


Either way.... sadly the further away from game two we get, the more likely it is going to be Smith vs Thomas to see who will be our resident John Jerry/Vernon Carey turnstile at RG for the season....

So why dont we get back on topic and figure out, who would we rather at this point, who is the least of the two evils.....

And with that in mind. I know we have commited to Collidge at one of the Guard spots... is he naturally a LG.... or can he play RG.... I got a funny feeling that Thomas would be a better LG than RG.... especially based on which side he blocks better towards...


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
Rock Sexton wrote:
I had been curious about rolling over adjusted cap. Didn't seem logical.

Overthecap has us on the hook for $150million in 2015 ....

http://overthecap.com/salary-cap/miami-dolphins


$144 million.

Only the top 51 contracts count against the cap.


What is the amount of unused cap rolled over from last year? 18mil ? And is it being used this year?

Obviously we have alot of contracts that would be easy to dump..So it's not like we are against the cap...The writing is on the walll for a few as there replacements have already been drafted.


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
Kev1321 wrote:
you have close to 5 million in dead cap this year ..not on the books next year, also


We still have $144 million tied up next year.


I think your right about some cuts that will happen, by the time next year rolls around I doubt that we are still at 144 mil.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Finster wrote:
Rich wrote:
Kev1321 wrote:
you have close to 5 million in dead cap this year ..not on the books next year, also


We still have $144 million tied up next year.


I think your right about some cuts that will happen, by the time next year rolls around I doubt that we are still at 144 mil.


Moore could very well happen in a couple weeks...That could very well be why Quinn is here.


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Kev1321 wrote:
What is the amount of unused cap rolled over from last year? 18mil ? And is it being used this year?


We are over the cap this year and are able to be over the cap because of the carry over from last year. But that carry over doesn't then roll over to next year. It expires.

Unless there is a way to designate if the carry over was used on a contract rather than normal cap space, which I doubt, we will be over the cap going into the 2015 offseason.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Moore will be traded if anything. More than likely he stays.

2014
Moore 5.5 Million
Tannehill 3.45 million
Quinn $855,000

The QB position is costing Miami less than $10 million dollars. I would say the value is great where we are.... even if Moore is more expensive than Tannehill. I highly doubt anything changes unless a trade were to come up.

The other problem is.... Moore at $5.5 million is probably a bit hard to swallow for another team at the current moment so unless an injury happens this week, I doubt he gets moved.

So Kev... i would say Matt Moore trade watch will last between Thursday 8/21 and Monday 8/23.. If a starter goes down, some one may be desperate enough to make a trade..... But i doubt he gets cut


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Moore is not going to be traded. There is no reason to trade him as he is a free agent after this season so he has no impact on the 2015 cap.

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:

The thread is about Thomas not playing well at right guard. The discussion evolved into acquiring a right guard to replace Thomas since he is not playing well at right guard (you know, a solution to the problem). And from there to the cap ramifications of doing so, at which point I jumped in to provide information pertinent to the discussion (since a solution to the problem was presented, what are the mechanics of that solution).
Its a MB. People inject opinion all the time. Its what the board is for. You are not a mod anyway, so its not left up to you to police the board.

Rich wrote:
Mind you, I didn't participate in the evolution of the discussion from Thomas, to upgrading to cap. I simply added context.
Still did not see you being johnny on the spot with this type comment then. What is so special now?

Mind you if I cared enough it would be easy to pull up post after post where you injected opinions/personal attack/smartarse comments that did not pertain to the topic.

Rich wrote:
You on the other hand decided to give an opinion about the current cap rules, which is completely irrelevant to the discussion about Thomas or right guard.
For the third time. Oblivious to to the manner in which you conduct yourself here & other boards..

Rich wrote:
Connect the dots should be a very easy game to play. What's holding you back?
Would hate to step on your toes, since you seem to want to make everyone else believe only you are capable of doing that.


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Dphins4me wrote:
Its a MB. People inject opinion all the time. Its what the board is for. You are not a mod anyway, so its not left up to you to police the board.


I didn't tell you to get back on topic. I simply pointed out that your comment was completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Time to get over yourself.

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Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:37 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
I didn't tell you to get back on topic. I simply pointed out that your comment was completely irrelevant to the discussion.
Yours add just what? The purpose of your comment was for what?

Rich wrote:
Time to get over yourself.
Still Obvious

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
WTF


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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Kev1321 wrote:
WTF


I see that I am not the only one scratching my head. :haha

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Rich wrote:
I see that I am not the only one scratching my head.

How did I know you would not reply with what your post added to the thread.


Last edited by Dphins4me on Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:14 pm
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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
*burp*

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Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Excuse you Mr. 21K post.


Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:17 pm
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Location: Miami, FL
Post Re: Dallas Thomas still a problem
Hi.

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Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:19 pm
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