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 Davone Bess to be cut??? 
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Post Davone Bess to be cut???
According to Rotoworld: The Palm Beach Post considers Davone Bess the Dolphins' No. 1 veteran in danger of being cut.
Bess and his non-guaranteed $2.63 million salary have been squarely on the bubble since the Dolphins signed Brandon Gibson. Cutting Bess would clear $2.7 million in cap space. Beat writer Ben Volin wouldn't be "shocked" if Bess was traded before or during the draft. It's getting harder to envision Bess in a Dolphins uniform come Week 1.


http://www.rotoworld.com/sports/nfl/football


Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:32 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
He's in the final year of his deal. That's probably why the Dolphins signed Gibson. By the same token of reasoning, that's why the Dolphins drafted Jonathan Martin last year knowing Jake Long was in the final year of his deal.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:34 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Bess is still one of our best receivers, I wouldn't move him unless the compensation was right, and even then it could wind up being a situation where we regret it later like Welker. If I were Ireland, the price would be a late 2nd or early 3rd for Bess. If it's the Patriots, Jets, or Bills, the price is a 1st.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:39 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
There are some receiver needy team who might jump at the chance to have Bess for his contract and the ability to extend him. The slot receiver market wasn't that high so a team in need of his services could land him for a mid round pick and lock him up for a few years.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:39 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
I would hate to see him on the patriots.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:45 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
wkloiber13 wrote:
Bess is still one of our best receivers, I wouldn't move him unless the compensation was right, and even then it could wind up being a situation where we regret it later like Welker. If I were Ireland, the price would be a late 2nd or early 3rd for Bess. If it's the Patriots, Jets, or Bills, the price is a 1st.


I doubt the Dolphins get a 2nd/3rd for Bess. Miami got a 2nd and a 3rd from the Bears for Brandon Marshall. I think you are looking at a mid round pick for Davone.

This is why I think Tavon Austin is still very much in play at #12.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:58 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
rodneyfaile wrote:
I would hate to see him on the patriots.


That is exactly my point. On New England that guy would probably have 100 receptions and close to 1,000 yards a season as much as Brady likes to dump it off to the slot guy. It would be a Wes Welker situation all over again.

If you are going to trade Bess, you'd prefer to send him to an NFC team. If an AFC team is interested, the price goes up. If a division opponent is interested, it goes even higher.

A nice situation would be the Vikings. They traded Percy Harvin away and could use a new slot receiver (assuming Jennings plays majority of snaps outside). I would be ok with us packaging Bess and a 2nd round pick for one of their first round picks. I think that would be a fair trade.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:01 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
phinsfansc wrote:
This is why I think Tavon Austin is still very much in play at #12.


They need help at CB far more than they do at WR. They need to find two CBs who can START. They already have WRs capable of starting.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:02 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
wkloiber13 wrote:
Bess is still one of our best receivers, I wouldn't move him unless the compensation was right, and even then it could wind up being a situation where we regret it later like Welker. If I were Ireland, the price would be a late 2nd or early 3rd for Bess. If it's the Patriots, Jets, or Bills, the price is a 1st.


I really like Bess. I would hate to see him go. But if Gibson is a faster slot receiver, then Bess may be done in Miami because of the salary. I think Miami will take what they can get for him through a trade during the draft. Even a 4th or 5th round pick is better than what Miami gets if they have to cut him for salary reasons. Remember Miami tried to shop Dansby for a trade prior to releasing him but there were no takers. Bess contract would be easier for a new team to take on as opposed to Dansbys but teams will also know he will be cut soon anyway.

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Last edited by bobby0112 on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:04 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
phinsfansc wrote:
wkloiber13 wrote:
Bess is still one of our best receivers, I wouldn't move him unless the compensation was right, and even then it could wind up being a situation where we regret it later like Welker. If I were Ireland, the price would be a late 2nd or early 3rd for Bess. If it's the Patriots, Jets, or Bills, the price is a 1st.


I doubt the Dolphins get a 2nd/3rd for Bess. Miami got a 2nd and a 3rd from the Bears for Brandon Marshall. I think you are looking at a mid round pick for Davone.

This is why I think Tavon Austin is still very much in play at #12.


Marshall had a much bigger contract, had a history of off the field problems, and was traded out of desperation. Trading Bess is a much different situation. We're not financially forced to trade him, in fact, we're not forced to trade him at all. Anybody that wants Bess would need to come to us, not the other way around.
Austin would be a waste of a pick when we already have Gibson who can play the slot. The whole idea of moving Bess would be to allow guys like Gibson and Matthews the opportunity to work in the slot.
If we're going to trade Bess and add another receiver, then we'd preferrably look for an outside guy like Patterson, Allen, Williams, Hunter, etc.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:04 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
bobby0112 wrote:
I really like Bess. I would hate to see him go. But if Gibson is a faster slot receiver, then Bess may be done in Miami because of the salary. I think Miami will take what they can get for him through a trade during the draft. Even a 4th or 5th round pick is better than what Miami gets if they have to cut him for salary reasons. Remember Miami tied to shop Dansby for a trade prior to releasing him but there were no takers. Bess contract would be easier for a new team to take on as opposed to Dansbys but teams will also know he will be cut soon anyway.


It makes literally no sense to depend on Gibson as our slot guy. He lined up in that position less than 20% of the last year. It's not his bread and butter by any means.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:05 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
bobby0112 wrote:
wkloiber13 wrote:
Bess is still one of our best receivers, I wouldn't move him unless the compensation was right, and even then it could wind up being a situation where we regret it later like Welker. If I were Ireland, the price would be a late 2nd or early 3rd for Bess. If it's the Patriots, Jets, or Bills, the price is a 1st.


I really like Bess. I would hate to see him go. But if Gibson is a faster slot receiver, then Bess may be done in Miami because of the salary. I think Miami will take what they can get for him through a trade during the draft. Even a 4th or 5th round pick is better than what Miami gets if they have to cut him for salary reasons. Remember Miami tried to shop Dansby for a trade prior to releasing him but there were no takers. Bess contract would be easier for a new team to take on as opposed to Dansbys but teams will also know he will be cut soon anyway.


Why not trade Bess and a 2nd round pick to the Vikings for a 1st round pick?

Then we could draft a cornerback or offensive lineman early in the 1st, then take someone like Keenan Allen with the other 1st.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:06 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
rodneyfaile wrote:
phinsfansc wrote:
This is why I think Tavon Austin is still very much in play at #12.


They need help at CB far more than they do at WR. They need to find two CBs who can START. They already have WRs capable of starting.


I'm well aware of the fact that the Dolphins need cornerbacks. I also know this is turning into a league that has become more and more about the offense. Miami averaged less than 20 points a game last year.

The CB class is deep, and the Dolphins can get quality cornerbacks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Also, it looks like Miami will have a good chance of bringing Brent Grimes into the fold.

I would have no problem with the Dolphins taking Xavier Rhodes at #12. I just believe Austin is still in play.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:09 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
bobby0112 wrote:
I really like Bess. I would hate to see him go. But if Gibson is a faster slot receiver, then Bess may be done in Miami because of the salary. I think Miami will take what they can get for him through a trade during the draft. Even a 4th or 5th round pick is better than what Miami gets if they have to cut him for salary reasons. Remember Miami tied to shop Dansby for a trade prior to releasing him but there were no takers. Bess contract would be easier for a new team to take on as opposed to Dansbys but teams will also know he will be cut soon anyway.


It makes literally no sense to depend on Gibson as our slot guy. He lined up in that position less than 20% of the last year. It's not his bread and butter by any means.


If we move Bess, there is no reason why Gibson couldn't fill that role. He's a good route runner with good hands. He could play whatever position we ask of him. His bread and butter is that he can line up anywhere and be effective. There is nothing preventing us from utilizing him as a slot receiver in three receiver sets, and then move him back outside when we go four wide.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:10 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
wkloiber13 wrote:
If we move Bess, there is no reason why Gibson couldn't fill that role. He's a good route runner with good hands. He could play whatever position we ask of him. His bread and butter is that he can line up anywhere and be effective. There is nothing preventing us from utilizing him as a slot receiver in three receiver sets, and then move him back outside when we go four wide.


Been over this relentlessly. You have to have quick burst off the line, have the hips, and gain YAC. Gibson doesn't do any of that. That's why when Amendola went out last year, Gibson still was BARELY playing the slot.

Gibson's "effectiveness" btw .... define effective for me. Effective enough to let walk by the Rams. let's not overstate this guy's talents please. He's average. He'll be a guy to help get us key first downs as that is really the main bright spot in his game .... and don't cite me his 5 TD's. Already been over that too. Fasano averaged almost that every season here.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:32 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Perhaps Miami is going to draft a replacement specifically for the slot and someone quicker/faster than Bess. Ireland's plan is clearly still in play and the draft hasn't even happened yet, so before we say getting rid of Bess is the wrong thing to do, let's see how it all plays out.

Maybe Austin is on their radar after all.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:15 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
We could not get a WR on the field other than Bess & hartline last year, now suddenly we are soo stacked that Bess will not make the roster?

Ohh Kay....

:runwiththeball: rock on

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:18 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
wkloiber13 wrote:
If we move Bess, there is no reason why Gibson couldn't fill that role. He's a good route runner with good hands. He could play whatever position we ask of him. His bread and butter is that he can line up anywhere and be effective. There is nothing preventing us from utilizing him as a slot receiver in three receiver sets, and then move him back outside when we go four wide.


Been over this relentlessly. You have to have quick burst off the line, have the hips, and gain YAC. Gibson doesn't do any of that. That's why when Amendola went out last year, Gibson still was BARELY playing the slot.

Gibson's "effectiveness" btw .... define effective for me. Effective enough to let walk by the Rams. let's not overstate this guy's talents please. He's average. He'll be a guy to help get us key first downs as that is really the main bright spot in his game .... and don't cite me his 5 TD's. Already been over that too. Fasano averaged almost that every season here.


I think with Gibson, our staff feels that he could be even better in Miami than he was in St. Louis. That's why we picked him. He's versatile (can play ever position), and from the looks of things he could be an ascending talent. Remember he's only 25 years old.

I could care less what Gibson's numbers were in St. Louis, I think he has the potential to be a very effective (good) 3rd or 4th target for Tannehill, and that includes operating in the slot.

Also, the Rams didn't let him walk, they made him a contract offer to stay. They tried to keep him. But Gibson had other offers, including the Dolphins, and chose Miami because of our offense and because of Tannehill. In fact, Wallace, Gibson, and Keller all cited Tannehill and Philbin's offense as reasons they chose Miami over other options.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:54 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
Been over this relentlessly. You have to have quick burst off the line, have the hips, and gain YAC. Gibson doesn't do any of that. That's why when Amendola went out last year, Gibson still was BARELY playing the slot.
Agree.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Gibson's "effectiveness" btw .... define effective for me. Effective enough to let walk by the Rams. let's not overstate this guy's talents please. He's average. He'll be a guy to help get us key first downs as that is really the main bright spot in his game ....
I like the fact he catches the ball when thrown to him & catches TD passes also.


Rock Sexton wrote:
and don't cite me his 5 TD's. Already been over that too. Fasano averaged almost that every season here.
Yea, lets not cite the most important stat of football. Gibson's TD = 5. Miami 2012 Wr corp = 3. Funny how you call him avg when he hung more TDs than the entire WR corp & 5 times more than the man they overpaid to keep.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:24 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Dphins4me wrote:
I like the fact he catches the ball when thrown to him & catches TD passes also.

It's funny you say that ..... I don't have access to the 2012 #'s, but nonetheless in 2011 he had a very poor drops rate %.

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Yea, lets not cite the most important stat of football. Gibson's TD = 5. Miami 2012 Wr corp = 3. Funny how you call him avg when he hung more TDs than the entire WR corp & 5 times more than the man they overpaid to keep.

The most important stat in football, but oh how so many times Fasano's TD's catches were understated as "well the ball had to go somewhere". Amazing how that works.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:38 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
It's funny you say that ..... I don't have access to the 2012 #'s, but nonetheless in 2011 he had a very poor drops rate %.
Yeap, but I believe I read he only dropped 5 last year. Did you notice who was right there with him? Brian Hartline. So if Gibson is so horrible, what does that say about what they paid Hartline?

Quote:
Dolphins' Brandon Gibson led NFL WRs in key category
ProFootballFocus.com has interesting statistic on Miami's newly-acquired player

The sixth-year receiver enjoyed career highs in receiving yards (691), yards per reception (13.5), touchdowns (5) and games started (13) in 2012 for the Rams.

The sixth-year receiver enjoyed career highs in receiving yards (691),…
March 18, 2013|By Chris Perkins

Dolphins wide receiver Brandon Gibson has an inside-the-numbers skill that probably greatly interested the coaches and scouts.

According to ProFootballFocus.com, Gibson, playing for St. Louis last season, led NFL wide receivers in first down and touchdown conversion percentage.

Gibson was targeted 75 times on first down or touchdown routes, and he converted 43 times for a 57.33 percent success rate


Rock Sexton wrote:
The most important stat in football, but oh how so many times Fasano's TD's catches were understated as "well the ball had to go somewhere". Amazing how that works.
Was that something I have posted? Don't recall anything like that. Its the second time I feel you want me to defend my position based on what someone else has posted. I've pretty much always thought Fasano was a decent TE with decent hands, but nothing special.

However, when the whole WR corp in 16 games can "ONLY" catch 3 TD passes, then I can understand how someone might make that statement. Which does not hold true for Gibson in St. Louis.

I do not view Gibson as anything special either, but rather the Wr that will hurt your team, because his skills do not scare you.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:24 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Dphins4me wrote:
Yeap, but I believe I read he only dropped 5 last year. Did you notice who was right there with him? Brian Hartline. So if Gibson is so horrible, what does that say about what they paid Hartline?

Who said he's horrible? I called him average.

Let me know when Gibson puts up 1,000 yards in a season. Let me know he puts up 250 yards in a game and 3 total games in a season of 100 yards or more. That is why he got paid, not to mention the potential he's got with a true #1 in Wallace across from him and a full offseason with the team. We've already broken down the Hartline contract on this site and it's not quite the "strangle" as you always you make it out to be as to how they're paying him.

One guy played himself into a new contract with his current team. The other was let walk, 5 TD's or not .... because he's average. Now I hope the guy proves me wrong and makes an impact, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it. I've long said I would've rather not have signed anymore FA wideouts and filled the position via the draft. That may still happen regardless with this Bess talk since they probably don't want to pay him a new contract.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:37 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
Who said he's horrible? I called him average.

Its implied with the LMFAO quote

Rock Sexton wrote:
Brandon Gibson? LMFAO.


Rock Sexton wrote:
Let me know when Gibson puts up 1,000 yards in a season. Let me know he puts up 250 yards in a game
Stephone Paige once hung 309 Yds in a game. Just proving even avg WR can have that game. Qadry Ismail once hung 258 Yds in a game. Just proving even below avg WR can have that game and those games came when DBs could look at Wrs. Heck even our own Chris Chambers put up a 238 Yd game & we all know what Miami fans thought of him. One game is just that. One game.

Rock Sexton wrote:
and 3 total games in a season of 100 yards or more.
Lets ignore his 12 games he could not top 80 Yds.

Rock Sexton wrote:
That is why he got paid, not to mention the potential he's got with a true #1 in Wallace across from him and a full offseason with the team.
Potential?

Rock Sexton wrote:
One guy played himself into a new contract with his current team. The other was let walk, 5 TD's or not .... because he's average.
So because the Rams choose to spend their money elsewhere means Gibson is not worth signing? What does that say that the Steelers did not sign Wallace or the Ravens did not sign Ellerbe/Oakland Wheeler? Gibson got paid for his skill level. Hartline got overpaid for his.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Now I hope the guy proves me wrong and makes an impact, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it. I've long said I would've rather not have signed anymore FA wideouts and filled the position via the draft. That may still happen regardless with this Bess talk since they probably don't want to pay him a new contract.
As would I.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:01 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Dphins4me wrote:
Its implied with the LMFAO quote

I actually wrote the word "average" but you want to pretend LMFAO means something else. Sure thing bud!

Quote:
Stephone Paige once hung 309 Yds in a game. Just proving even avg WR can have that game. Qadry Ismail once hung 258 Yds in a game. Just proving even below avg WR can have that game and those games came when DBs could look at Wrs. Heck even our own Chris Chambers put up a 238 Yd game & we all know what Miami fans thought of him. One game is just that. One game.

Ya, except again Hartline with 3 games of 100 yards or more this last year. Tell me, has Gibson ever put up anywhere close to that in a season? Ismail and Chambers were better than Gibson btw. Hartline's best 3 games that you harp about account for 471 yards, nearly doubling Gibson's 267.

Quote:
Lets ignore his 12 games he could not top 80 Yds.

How many for Gibson? Let's ignore those too, just like you like to ignore Hartline's best games this year because of some cherry picked examples you previously gave.

Quote:
Potential?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/potential

Rock Sexton wrote:
So because the Rams choose to spend their money elsewhere means Gibson is not worth signing? What does that say that the Steelers did not sign Wallace or the Ravens did not sign Ellerbe/Oakland Wheeler? Gibson got paid for his skill level. Hartline got overpaid for his.

Not even remotely an accurate comparison in each situation. Said players received aggressive pay increases that did not fit into their previous team's budgets. All three were impact players.

Once gain Hartline was paid based on this season's production, his chemistry with our young QB, and the potential he has when teamed up with Mike Wallace.

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Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:30 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Rock Sexton wrote:
I actually wrote the word "average" but you want to pretend LMFAO means something else. Sure thing bud!
We all know LMFAO is always a good thing when referring to a player. Great idea though. How bout you keep to what I have actually written. At least I have for you. Twice you have came at me over things someone else said and asking me to respond.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Ya, except again Hartline with 3 games of 100 yards or more this last year.
3 whole games? Call Canton.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Tell me, has Gibson ever put up anywhere close to that in a season?
Don't care. Not going to miss 3 whole games of 100 Yds+ and 1 Td. Not going to win many game with those type stats.


Rock Sexton wrote:
Ismail and Chambers were better than Gibson btw.
I guess that is why the Vikes, Pack & Miami & Saints walked away from him. Because he was so good.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Hartline's best 3 games that you harp about account for 471 yards, nearly doubling Gibson's 267.
Do Yds win football game or TDs? So what you are saying is Hartline got 43% of his yards in 3 games. That leaves only 57% of his yd total for the other 13. Actually 12 since he went catchless/yardless in one game. Guess one could easily say Hartline runs cold far more than hot. Look at the bright side. If Hartline stays on pace of the last 3 yrs he will equal Gibson's TD total in 2012 in two more yrs.

No one said Gibson was better than Hartline. However, for the cost difference. I'll take Gibson over Hartline.

Rock Sexton wrote:
How many for Gibson? Let's ignore those too, just like you like to ignore Hartline's best games this year because of some cherry picked examples you previously gave.
Sorry those examples don't work for you and help point out how even lesser Wr can have an unreal game.

This applies to Hartline? Miami is paying Hartline that much for the hope he might do something? Nice.

Rock Sexton wrote:
Not even remotely an accurate comparison in each situation. Said players received aggressive pay increases that did not fit into their previous team's budgets. All three were impact players.
What makes you think Gibson pay increase fit into his former teams budget? The fact the Rams also let Danny Amendola walk probably helps that argument.

Remember Miami was so not interested in Wheeler last year they did not make him an offer worth signing


Rock Sexton wrote:
Once gain Hartline was paid based on this season's production, his chemistry with our young QB, and the potential he has when teamed up with Mike Wallace.
What production? 1 Td., but I guess if yds is what you like then we will pay for that. What you are saying is Miami is paying Hartline not because he is that good, but he is safe & they know what they are getting. Really do not get paying a player that much money for the hope another player at the same position will help him.


Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:57 pm
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
The fact the Rams also let Danny Amendola walk probably helps that argument.

Just a quick opinion on this, Jeff Fisher wanted Amendole back and the owner loved him too, it was the money part that prevented it, so hence the reason he signed for more money elsewhere.


No doubt Miami over paid for Hartline, BUT, his career and production keeps going UP, he gets open and catches the ball, has continuity with Tannehill. I think he will be an excellent Ed McCaffrey type player and he is an important part to the offense. I know 1 touchdown catch doesn't show much, but I will bet you if he stays healthy with Wallace now that Hartline gets 6-7 TD's this season (My opinion).

Gibson runs good routes, good sized target and reliable hands. Again when you have a threat like Wallace in the passing game, it helps free up others to get open and like a Danny Amendola who has good hands, both Hartline and Gibson have those qualities, plus they are Philbin kind of guys.

Will Gibson be all-pro, no, but can he be a chain mover, I believe so.


Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:56 am
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Post Re: Davone Bess to be cut???
Finhead34 wrote:
Just a quick opinion on this, Jeff Fisher wanted Amendole back and the owner loved him too, it was the money part that prevented it, so hence the reason he signed for more money elsewhere.
The Rams drafted two Wr with plans of not having to pony up more than they wanted, which is why both are on new teams.

Finhead34 wrote:
No doubt Miami over paid for Hartline, BUT, his career and production keeps going UP, he gets open and catches the ball, has continuity with Tannehill. I think he will be an excellent Ed McCaffrey type player and he is an important part to the offense. I know 1 touchdown catch doesn't show much, but I will bet you if he stays healthy with Wallace now that Hartline gets 6-7 TD's this season (My opinion).
McCaffrey is a perfect comparison of Hartline. I just would like to see Hartline produce like McCaffrey before he got paid handsomely.


Finhead34 wrote:
Will Gibson be all-pro, no, but can he be a chain mover, I believe so.
I agree.


Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:22 am
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