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 Very interesting read on Randy Starks move and tweaks to 3-4 
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Post Starks to NT
per Ireland's press conference. Starks will be the NT and Odrick will be the DE. I really like the Odrick pick alot now.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:09 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Hen just posted this in another thread.

I love the Odrick pick now if Starks is successful at NT, which, while I think he will be, I think is a waste of his abilities. We'll see how it all works out.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:12 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Could be Ireland talk....

I think they bring in someone, either UDFA or someone with the 7 picks remaining.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:16 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
The Hen wrote:
Could be Ireland talk....

I think they bring in someone, either UDFA or someone with the 7 picks remaining.


Perhaps, but then what was the point of picking Odrick?

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:17 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
RDE

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:18 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Iowafin wrote:
The Hen wrote:
Could be Ireland talk....

I think they bring in someone, either UDFA or someone with the 7 picks remaining.


Perhaps, but then what was the point of picking Odrick?


Clearly Miami listened to you, iowa, eh? "Play him at OLB"....so they convert him to NT. LOL.

:ann0y: :)


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:19 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Man we have 7 picks left... the Patsies have 8... wtf man the Pats always seem to get better and better... they added Jermaine Cunningham and Brandon Spikes from my Gators.... and they go Ronkowski to fill in at TE... ugh!!!

Anyways... back to the topic... Starks is about Jay Ratliff size too isn't he?? I like the move of him to NT... mainly because I think he'll be an every down player and be switching over to DT in 4-3 sets... it'll be interesting to see what our starting Defensive Line looks like come week 1!!


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:21 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
The Hen wrote:
Could be Ireland talk....

I think they bring in someone, either UDFA or someone with the 7 picks remaining.


Perhaps, but then what was the point of picking Odrick?


Clearly Miami listened to you, iowa, eh? "Play him at OLB"....so they convert him to NT. LOL.

:ann0y: :)


Lol..yeah, I said they might have three options, didn't think of moving him inside to NT.

It's plausible, but he's not really a two gap guy. I don't really know what their intentions are.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:23 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
The Hen wrote:
RDE


Just as depth or what?

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:23 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
Man we have 7 picks left... the Patsies have 8... wtf man the Pats always seem to get better and better... they added Jermaine Cunningham and Brandon Spikes from my Gators.... and they go Ronkowski to fill in at TE... ugh!!!

Anyways... back to the topic... Starks is about Jay Ratliff size too isn't he?? I like the move of him to NT... mainly because I think he'll be an every down player and be switching over to DT in 4-3 sets... it'll be interesting to see what our starting Defensive Line looks like come week 1!!


Remember that he struggled heavily in 2008 at NT when he was forced in there.

PZ man, what happened to that awesome sig you had?
:ann0y:


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:24 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
IamPZ wrote:
Man we have 7 picks left... the Patsies have 8... wtf man the Pats always seem to get better and better... they added Jermaine Cunningham and Brandon Spikes from my Gators.... and they go Ronkowski to fill in at TE... ugh!!!

Anyways... back to the topic... Starks is about Jay Ratliff size too isn't he?? I like the move of him to NT... mainly because I think he'll be an every down player and be switching over to DT in 4-3 sets... it'll be interesting to see what our starting Defensive Line looks like come week 1!!


Remember that he struggled heavily in 2008 at NT when he was forced in there.

PZ man, what happened to that awesome sig you had?
:ann0y:


That was 2008 how the F am I supposed to remember that? I don't even remember what I had for dinner last night...

Sadly the Bills ruined my hopes and dreams....


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:25 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Iowa, this is Ireland talking......LOL

Sparano and Nolan will have the final say, I would think. He did say , "not to give away any stratagy". LOL

The "versatility" they have added has me thinking alot of things.

Anyway's, the Ireland PC is on MD.com

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:28 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
The Hen wrote:
Iowa, this is Ireland talking......LOL

Sparano and Nolan will have the final say, I would think. He did say , "not to give away any stratagy". LOL

The "versatility" they have added has me thinking alot of things.

Anyway's, the Ireland PC is on MD.com


Yeah, I know, you just said you figured they'd get a NT elsewhere and not put Starks there. That, to me, almost makes Odrick as a wasted pick...I just don't think you draft depth guys in the first round.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Randy is best as a DE/DT. You can line him up over the center in pass rush downs, but playing Randy at NT for run downs is not a good idea in my opinion.

Miami needs to take a NT prospect tomorrow with one of there picks.

Plus, it not like Jeff has not spoken with a forked tongue a few times already.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:35 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Iowafin wrote:
The Hen wrote:
Iowa, this is Ireland talking......LOL

Sparano and Nolan will have the final say, I would think. He did say , "not to give away any stratagy". LOL

The "versatility" they have added has me thinking alot of things.

Anyway's, the Ireland PC is on MD.com


Yeah, I know, you just said you figured they'd get a NT elsewhere and not put Starks there. That, to me, almost makes Odrick as a wasted pick...I just don't think you draft depth guys in the first round.


Does any of it really matter as far as who's starting in the beginning of the game? Anyone who has been to a game with this new Front Office running things has seen just how often they switch packages... it's unbelievable. Almost every play there are players swapping in and out on defense... all of these guys will serve a purpose for the different packages this team likes to run.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:36 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
Does any of it really matter as far as who's starting in the beginning of the game? Anyone who has been to a game with this new Front Office running things has seen just how often they switch packages... it's unbelievable. Almost every play there are players swapping in and out on defense... all of these guys will serve a purpose for the different packages this team likes to run.


To a certain extent, you're right, and to another extent; they were switching in and out because nobody was an every down player.
Yes, you want to rotate bodies on the front line to keep them fresh, but why draft a guy in the 1st that you plan on rotating and playing on a 1/3 of the snaps? You've gotta have a guy that takes the majority...who's it going to be? If they think it's Odrick, then ok, but who does that push out?

I can guarantee Dansby isn't on and off the field...he'll get his rest maybe somewhere in the game if the defense is getting run over, but as an ILB getting huge money, you better be on the field every play.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:45 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
I'm just saying... I don't think these guys are so much looking for guys who can go out there and play a certain number of snaps... I think they're looking for guys who perform at a high level when they are out there... get a bunch of guys together who can perform at a high level then you have the luxury of continuously swapping players in and out without much difference in the talent level.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:49 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
I'm just saying... I don't think these guys are so much looking for guys who can go out there and play a certain number of snaps... I think they're looking for guys who perform at a high level when they are out there... get a bunch of guys together who can perform at a high level then you have the luxury of continuously swapping players in and out without much difference in the talent level.

Gotchya. Similar to what the Giants had when they won the Super Bowl

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:51 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
Hen just posted this in another thread.

I love the Odrick pick now if Starks is successful at NT, which, while I think he will be, I think is a waste of his abilities. We'll see how it all works out.


Have you ever watched Dallas's nose tackle?

He puts up similar numbers to Starks.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:54 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
The Hen wrote:
RDE


Can't have three starting defensive ends...

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
Remember that he struggled heavily in 2008 at NT when he was forced in there.


He didn't really the position in the preseason.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Hen just posted this in another thread.

I love the Odrick pick now if Starks is successful at NT, which, while I think he will be, I think is a waste of his abilities. We'll see how it all works out.


Have you ever watched Dallas's nose tackle?

He puts up similar numbers to Starks.


They're similar yeah. Ratliff is a generational type of a player, (if that makes any sense). Never has a 34 NT done what ratliff does.

I realize we are trying to mimmick that with Starks, but it's going to ber very hard to do. Maybe Odrick can be our Canty and Starks our Ratliff, we'll see.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:56 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Iowafin wrote:
The Hen wrote:
Iowa, this is Ireland talking......LOL

Sparano and Nolan will have the final say, I would think. He did say , "not to give away any stratagy". LOL

The "versatility" they have added has me thinking alot of things.

Anyway's, the Ireland PC is on MD.com


Yeah, I know, you just said you figured they'd get a NT elsewhere and not put Starks there. That, to me, almost makes Odrick as a wasted pick...I just don't think you draft depth guys in the first round.


Exactly. Unless you don't have holes.

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:57 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
Never has a 34 NT done what ratliff does.



At some point in the past, you could say that for any position. There is always a first when a new trend starts.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
Iowafin wrote:
The Hen wrote:
Iowa, this is Ireland talking......LOL

Sparano and Nolan will have the final say, I would think. He did say , "not to give away any stratagy". LOL

The "versatility" they have added has me thinking alot of things.

Anyway's, the Ireland PC is on MD.com


Yeah, I know, you just said you figured they'd get a NT elsewhere and not put Starks there. That, to me, almost makes Odrick as a wasted pick...I just don't think you draft depth guys in the first round.


Does any of it really matter as far as who's starting in the beginning of the game? Anyone who has been to a game with this new Front Office running things has seen just how often they switch packages... it's unbelievable. Almost every play there are players swapping in and out on defense... all of these guys will serve a purpose for the different packages this team likes to run.


:yay:

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Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:02 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
With the plan to move Starks to NT, the Odrick pick makes alot more since.......and keeping that info in-house allowed the Fins to make everyone think they were looking for a NT while they were really looking for a DE. :yay:

So that means a starting DE job is up for grabs between Merling and Odrick......should be a good battle to watch for during camp. :runwiththeball:

I still hope they draft someone to groom into the NT position over the next few years, as it seems like Soliai will never be more than a serviceable backup at the position.......


Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:05 pm
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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Never has a 34 NT done what ratliff does.



At some point in the past, you could say that for any position. There is always a first when a new trend starts.


Absolutely. But how many times have teams tried to mimmick these new "inventions" and failed? Just saying it is tough to do.

Starks said that he is up for it though, so, I'm glad they got the OK from him.

I do agree with Hen though in that they will take somebody in the later rounds here.

Maybe my boy out of UMass?? And btw, congrats to UMass....had a 2nd round pick today in Ducasse. That's awesome. First player out of there to be drafted, and just the 3rd player in the NFL from UMass. :clap:


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Post Re: Starks to NT
I'm kinda confused here... is Cameron Wake a OLB on the roster or a DE??

I remember him lining up mostly in a 3 point stance which would say he's a DE... but no one seems to be mentioning his name for this "battle for DE spot" conversation.


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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
I'm kinda confused here... is Cameron Wake a OLB on the roster or a DE??

I remember him lining up mostly in a 3 point stance which would say he's a DE... but no one seems to be mentioning his name for this "battle for DE spot" conversation.


In a 34 Defense, a DE is pretty much a DT. Wake is an OLB in our base 34 D.

But Wake did not play hardly any base defense last year. He usually just came in on pass rush situations, where Miami ran a 4 D-line set and so there Cam was a DE.


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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
IamPZ wrote:
I'm kinda confused here... is Cameron Wake a OLB on the roster or a DE??

I remember him lining up mostly in a 3 point stance which would say he's a DE... but no one seems to be mentioning his name for this "battle for DE spot" conversation.


In a 34 Defense, a DE is pretty much a DT. Wake is an OLB in our base 34 D.

But Wake did not play hardly any base defense last year. He usually just came in on pass rush situations, where Miami ran a 4 D-line set and so there Cam was a DE.


That explains a lot... I thought I was going crazy or something because I keep seeing his name associated with being a Linebacker but never really remember seeing him play standing up.


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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
Absolutely. But how many times have teams tried to mimmick these new "inventions" and failed?


I don't know. Do you have the statistics on that? If not, why even bring it up?

I do know that there was a first time use for the shotgun formation, the spread offense, the I-formation, the 43 defense, the Tampa 2, the end around, the return of the 34 defense, the onside kick.

All those things succeeded and were then mimmicked. This has already succeeded under these same guys.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
I'm kinda confused here... is Cameron Wake a OLB on the roster or a DE??

I remember him lining up mostly in a 3 point stance which would say he's a DE... but no one seems to be mentioning his name for this "battle for DE spot" conversation.


In a 34 defense you want your defensive ends to be at least 6'4 and at least 290 lbs.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
Absolutely. But how many times have teams tried to mimmick these new "inventions" and failed?


I don't know. Do you have the statistics on that? If not, why even bring it up?

I do know that there was a first time use for the shotgun formation, the spread offense, the I-formation, the 43 defense, the Tampa 2, the end around, the return of the 34 defense, the onside kick.

All those things succeeded and were then mimmicked. This has already succeeded under these same guys.


I'm not trying to bring specifics into the argument. It just seems that you think it is going to be an easy transition, and others feel the same way. I'm just not so sure that it is going to be that simple.


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Post Re: Starks to NT
Phins Rock wrote:
I'm not trying to bring specifics into the argument. It just seems that you think it is going to be an easy transition, and others feel the same way. I'm just not so sure that it is going to be that simple.


I'm interested in seeing it unfold. I like the idea. Doing something innovate can be fun. Look at how the Jets and Ravens defenses play? One of those Ravens defenses was Nolan's by the way. Innovative to the max. Expect a lot of pressure on the QB this year.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
I'm not trying to bring specifics into the argument. It just seems that you think it is going to be an easy transition, and others feel the same way. I'm just not so sure that it is going to be that simple.


I'm interested in seeing it unfold. I like the idea. Doing something innovate can be fun. Look at how the Jets and Ravens defenses play? One of those Ravens defenses was Nolan's by the way. Innovative to the max. Expect a lot of pressure on the QB this year.


I hope so. I am just concerned about the outsides. I really like Misi and Wake, but they are both weak side guys. Anderson can play the elephant, but do you really want him starting for you there?

I'm interested to see what they do here in rounds 4 and 5 regarding OLB. I'd be surprised if they did not get a bigger guy.

I agree though. If the transition is smooth, you've got one heck of an athletic, active, penetrating D-line with some great talent on the outsides from Wake and Misi, along with a guy like Dansby who can bring the heat from the interior.


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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
Phins Rock wrote:
I'm not trying to bring specifics into the argument. It just seems that you think it is going to be an easy transition, and others feel the same way. I'm just not so sure that it is going to be that simple.


I'm interested in seeing it unfold. I like the idea. Doing something innovate can be fun. Look at how the Jets and Ravens defenses play? One of those Ravens defenses was Nolan's by the way. Innovative to the max. Expect a lot of pressure on the QB this year.


I'm very excited to see this Mike Nolan defense... look what he did with a whole lot of scrubs in Denver last year... this guy just flat out knows defense.

Note on JP's post... if Griffen falls I think we should take him as he's a much bigger LB than Misi... thoughts?


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Post Re: Starks to NT
IamPZ wrote:
Note on JP's post... if Griffen falls I think we should take him as he's a much bigger LB than Misi... thoughts?


You CANNOT pass up Griffen in round 4. In the 4th round, considering the need and the talent, the character issues go right out the window. I think Coach Sparano can get to him and get the most out of him.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out. Big whoop. If he does, you all of a sudden have 3 legit OLBs who can all bring heat and who all have different talents that they bring to the table.


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Post Very interesting read on Randy Starks move and tweaks to 3-4
This is from Armando Salguero of the Miami Herald. Very interesting as he talks about tweaks that Mike Nolan is making to the 3-4 scheme.

Meet Dolphins new starting NT: Randy Starks

Dolphins general Jeff Ireland just announced that the Dolphins have resolved their nose tackle issues.

The team's new starting nose tackle is Randy Starks.

"[Coach] Tony [Sparano] talked to Randy about it today," Ireland said. "The quote he gave was, 'I'm at home there.' "

Not really certain I was hearing correctly that the team moved it's best defensive end to nose tackle, I asked Ireland if Starks had to compete for the starting NT job. He said Starks is indeed penciled in as the starter.

That has definite repercussions.

First-round pick Jared Odrick, Kendall Langford and Phillip Merling will compete for two starting jobs at defensive end.

Paul Soliai remains the team's backup nose tackle. And Jason Ferguson, out the first eight games of the season while serving an league-imposed suspension, can probably ease in and take fewer snaps per game than in the past. That, by the way, is a good way for Ferguson to stay healthy.

Also, the Dolphins are likely moving away form the classic 3-4 to a hybrid version where the nose tackle is often offset to one side or the other of the center. In the past, Miami's nose tackle was seemingly always over the center's helmet.

Most importantly, the move puts the draft in a different light. Before this announcement, everyone believed the Dolphins needed to address the nose tackle and free safety position on Saturday.

Now we now they have a need at free safety, having addressed defensive end (Odrick), wide receiver (Brandon Marshall), nose tackle (Randy Starks), and outside linebacker (Koa Misi). That's a pretty awesome way to spackle holes on the roster.

I like it.

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Post Re: Starks to NT
Rich wrote:
The Hen wrote:
RDE


Can't have three starting defensive ends...


No you can't....

Quote:
First-round pick Jared Odrick, Kendall Langford and Phillip Merling will compete for two starting jobs at defensive end.


Read more: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins ... z0lzZ8xfM5

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RIP, Tom


Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:50 pm
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Phinfever Global Moderator & FFL Commish
Phinfever Global Moderator & FFL Commish

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:28 am
Posts: 7530
Location: Massachusetts
Post Re: Very interesting read on Randy Starks move and tweaks to 3-4
I don't usually go for Mando's articles, but that was a nice little read that I agree with.

Miami has done a great job of filling needs early on and getting good value at the same time.


Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:54 pm
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