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Hartline all the way. He makes plays. Though I definitely can see Camarillo rotating in there too.. He has made way to many clutch plays for us to just sit him. Bess too. But, Bess will primarily be the slot guy.

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Hartline plays like an NFL receiver. He's fearless, he can make adjustments, he can get downfield when needed. He should be the #2 with camarillo rotating in and out, bess will likely stay in the slot and rip people apart in single coverage all year.

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I say it's Hartlines spot to loose........or it will be a rotation deal with Cam,Bess, and Turner but for the most part Hartline.

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I actually went with Camarillo. If Hartline can surpass him I'll be thrilled.

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I see a nice 4 WR set with Marshall - Hartline - Bess - Camarillo...

I see good things for Henne's comp % already....

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Caution: Reply may contain sarcasm

All in all I think that they will all have a better season with Marshall having most of the focus on him.

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In terms of production. Hartline surpassed him last year. As a rookie.

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Who the heck voted for Pat Turner?? Lol.

Pat Turner....or the rest of Ginn's family that are still here....lol

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Camarillo does not have the speed to be a starter.

Turner has done nothing.

Bess is a little small for the starting role but is valuable in the slot in three receiver sets.

Hartline has good size, speed, and excellent hands. I think he is suffering from the Toby Gerhart disease because I think he would be a lot more respected if he was a different skin tone. Hartline should be the other starter.

Wow......never thought I would live to see the day a "White" player has to break down color barriers.....lol. I don't think his skin color has anything to do with it. It's not like he ripped the league up last year,and now he's not getting a shot at the #2 (wr) job. None of our (wr)'s had that good of a year to say who is the clear cut #2. JMO

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i went with HARTLINE. being im from ohio i have seen him play alot. & i have also meet him in person. he is a very smart kid & deffently has the will to get better he is always on his game & is a eat sleep football type person that is the kind of people PARCELS & SOPRANO likes on there team & i agree that is the best kind to have on a team

What a homer...lol...I think he fits our team to a "T"

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Hartline faster than Camarillo? I don't know about that. Maybe on the track, but on the football field, Camarillo is as smooth as butter.

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Quickness in and out of breaks is one thing, but straight line it's not even close. Hartline is pretty tough to keep up with, while Cam...not so much. Lol.

Hartline's not a burner, but he does have much more speed than Cam. JMO, though.

I think that Hartline had a very good rookie year but while I don't think his skin color is going to keep him from starting or playing, I do think it contributes to people outside of the team over looking him. Hartline is not a slow possession receiver, but people who only see his skin tone just label him has that without really evaluating his talent.

Hartline....and it is a very easy decision. He had more TD's than any other Miami receiver, despite not being a starter for most of the season. He averaged over 16 yards per catch, no one else even came close. Sure hands, plays smart. Camarillo and Bess will be fighting for the action in the slot and I actually favor Camarillo there. Bess is a fine slot receiver too....but he makes no big plays and gets almost no yardage after the catch or contact.

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Philbin's countenance exudes confidence!
1984 was so long ago...Will there ever be another rainbow?

I still say it was due to the fact he was a rookie,and our (wr)'s didn't put any fear in other teams secondary. I they thought he was just a "slow possession receiver" and labeled him that way cause of his skin color, then they didn't watch any film on him before they played him. Just think it was as a hole that D-feces didn't fear our (wr)'s. It didn't look to me that they showed Bess or Cam anymore respect than Hartline, they played them all the same...JMO.....I could be wrong, and if I am then Iowa will let me know about....or all of us know...lol lol

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I see Hartline as the starting #2 he has so much more potential and big play ability. Camarillo should prove to be useful on short 3rd downs and 4 reciever sets though. Turner could turn out to be a great #2 on the practice squad ... You must really suck in practice to not be able to get on the field with the mediocrity at wr we were sporting last year.

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“We all stink. We're 0-6, everybody stinks. We’ve all, in some way, shape or form have not been good enough I don’t care if it’s the front-desk secretary — she ain’t doing a good enough job.”-Reggie Bush

This is a joke right? Lol. It's not even close. Camarillo might be the slowest WR in the league. He runs great routes and has great hands though.

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Uh, no...slowest receiver in the league? You don't catch 11 balls against an NFL defense by being the slowest in the league. You certainly don't outrun the Ravens defense if you're the slowest in the NFL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2WOUtDT ... re=related

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I went with Hartline as the #2 WR to start the season.......I also belive either he or Camarillo could get the job done though, especially with Marshall on the other side of them.

Bess will probably play 95% from the slot on offense, and if Turner is good enough to get time on the field then we could see Hartline and Camarillo from the slot every now and again as well.

I went with Hartline because he has the best combination of skills outside of Marshall to be a starter......catches well, runs good enough routes, good speed, good height and good understanding of offense......he is not the best WR on the team at any one area, but he is good enough in them all to be the #2 WR on the fins.

Its not like he outran the Ravens D. He ran a good route.. And the throw was on point. He was already behind the D when he caught the ball.. All he had to do is run for his life and hope that he didn't get caught by the DB. Not to mention this was PRE injury for him.

He is slow. There is no arguing it. You can catch 11 balls against an NFL defense when you are slow.. If you run good routes. His foot speed.. His running speed is slow. He has said as much himself.. Sparano has implied it. Other WR's made fun of him after the Ravens game saying they'd never seen him run that fast ever..because he is a slow WR. Slowest in the NFL might have been a stretch. But, he is the slowest on the team.. He is also probably ONE of the slowest in the league. Route running, intelligence and good quickness make up for a lot.

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This is one of the biggest jokes I've ever read. So you're saying he didn't outrun the Baltimore defense, he was just running and Baltimore happened to be behind him.

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No.. he ran a good route. The DB had no safety help. He got underneath. Caught the ball.. And kept running.. The DB was already behind him at that point because of the route he ran. He didn't create separation because of his speed.. he created it because he ran the route well.

I'm sorry you find this to be a joke. I am also sorry that you don't understand the difference between a well run route and speed. I'm done.

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How do you run a good route if you're slow? When Camarillo caught the ball he was even with Jermaine Winborne, by the time he got to endzone he was a good 6 yards in front of him. He had no safety help? Ed Reed and Winborne were covering him...that's two safeties.
He outran them. If you honestly think Camarillo is that slow, then you're sorely mistaken.

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Remember, iowa, that play was before the ACL.

I'm with Hypo. Cam is as slow as you will find at the WR position in the NFL. He's got a great understanding and feel for running routes, and that's why he is always open. I am looking forward to seeing a little more quickness, though, after the catch this year now 2 years removed from the ACL.

1. The ACL has nothing to do with straight line speed...it effects your lateral movements. 2. He's had surgery and a year to recover, and another offseason right now, so even if it did effect how fast he was he should be close 100% by now.

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His 100% is still slow

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That's exactly why I think he will be expendable. When Grice-Mullen gets up to speed in the playbook he and Bess will terrorize the NFL. Making Camarillo all but useless.

You guys just don't know talent. RGM has never stepped on to the field, and yet he will make Camarillo expendable, a guy who hasn't dropped a pass, and kept Miami from going 0-16.

Guys like Camarillo are never expendable...but yet you guys are probably the same that thought Wes Welker going for a 2 and 7 was an outstanding deal.

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Are you kidding me?..I'll take Camarillo's 60 catches (with no drops I might add) to Grice-Mullen's 30 career CFL catches (over two seasons) any day!!.

I'm not sure what you guy's think your getting here in Grice-Mullen but I watch a lot of CFL football and to be honest this guy never stood out to me, he has marginal receiving stats and I don't recall him returning anything for touchdowns and he returned both punts and kicks... He was just average,now don't get me wrong I hope he does well in Miami but from what I've seen of this guy I'm not sure he even makes the team..

Now Cameron Wake?..That's a different story, I was never happier to see a guy leave the CFL like I was to see this guy go. Now if he would of played for my team it would have been a different story but good riddance I say. I just hope that he can turn out to be a game changer for the Fins as he was with the Lions just a relentless pass rusher that had to be accounted for every single down..

For the record I say Hartline is our #2

I think you guys need to define what you mean by slow........Camarillo appears to be one of the slower WR on the team, but I don't think he's running a 5.0 second forty time or anything......if the other guys are running a 4.5 or 4.6 time, then he may be a 4.7 or something?......so he is slower, but by one step......not by 2 or 3 steps.....jmo

No I agree. He could beat me in a race. Lol. He is just slow for his position.

Iowa.. I never agreed or said anything about RGM.. Don't lump me in there. As for me not knowing talent.. Well I think this is more of a case you not understanding how WR's create separation. Because Camarillo didn't outrun the whole Ravens D. That is ludicrous.

The facts are there for you buddy. The guy is a slow WR. It's been said by NFL talent.. talent evaluators.. His own headcoach. He has even admitted that he is not fast by any means.

Here's an article for you.. Where Sparano basically implies he is slow. . . and many other things..
http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/ ... r-dolphins

With quotes like this from Anthony Fasano.. and more



So I guess.. Fasano.. Sparano.. and myself.. we don't know anything about talent.

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Wth? Basically implies? First, that is code for "may or may not have said." Second, he doesn't imply anything. All he said was Camarillo is intelligent. I don't know what scouts or what have you are saying he's slow.

I really don't know what to say to you. Camarillo is faster than you give him credit. He's not even the slowest on the team. If you go strictly 40 time:

Marshall- 4.57
Hartline- 4.52
Bess- 4.68
Camarillo- 4.60
Turner- 4.65

If you go play on the field, he plays faster than Hartline...maybe because Hartline was a rookie, but Camarillo is faster on the field.

Slowest in the NFL...you say I'm ludacris for pointing a FACT...he freakin' out ran Jamaine Winborne (Who supposedly runs a 4.5 40 time) for a TD and you refuse to believe it.

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I gotta agree with you on this one Iowa, Camarillo is fast enough to be an effective receiver, I just think guy's like to dog him because he's not very flashy....who cares he catches the flipping football isn't that what a receiver is supposed to do?..Have we forgotten that we just ran one of the fastest receivers in the league out of town because he couldn't do what Camarillo is good at .....NO DROPS!!

Camarillo reminds me of Oronde Gadsden not flashy, not the fastest guy on the field but he sure as hell caught everything that was thrown his way..

Here is a breakdown of the play you guys are talking about from NFL.com


Click here to learn how to add YouTube Videos to your phpBB forum

Winborn is running with him and Camarillo pulls away towards the end. Yes this is pre-injury, but I'm not sure how much the injury did to his speed?

Man that was a good day......I still remember how excited I was watching this play live, knowing the Fins would not go 0-16 on the season!

Wilborne.. stumbles after he catches the ball he also clearly gives up on the play.. as you see him slow down.

I'm not questioning Camarillo as a player.. Or even trashing the guy. I am saying he is a slow WR. I am saying his ROUTE Running is how he gains separation. I like the player a lot. It's just obvious that he isn't fast. He's said as much. So have others. It's all over he scouting profile. Even the article equated him as no special athlete.. Likely have a family members as fast as him. Lol. Come on..

I'm done arguing the point. I thought it was a well known fact he was a slow WR. His routes are exceptional and so are his hands and intelligence.

BTW, Iowa.. I love how you choose the higher of the times Bess posted. Because his other was 4.59. Only Turner is slower.. And Turner is HUGE.

And I don't know where you get that he plays faster then Hartline from lol. Maybe off the line and in quickness. But, Hartline is bigger, faster and more of a deep threat then Camarillo. The stats prove that.


Frankly, I'm not concerned with what you think.. If you want to think he's fast. Then go ahead. Lol. I'm not stopping you. We will just have to agree to disagree.

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